Josep Maria Estela: "We cannot afford to do without Major Trapero and his experience"

BarcelonaJosep Maria Estela (Alcarràs, 1970) has been the new chief commissioner of the Mossos d'Esquadra for a month. His appointment to replace Major Josep Lluís Trapero and the changes in the leadership that he has already carried out have raised strong suspicions. There has been talk of purging, but he defends them as a renewal in accordance with the new project and way of doing things that he wants to deploy in the stage that begins after 27 years of career within the police force.

Would he prefer to have reached the position of head of the Mossos without so much noise?

— Probably yes, because we have an assignment, a lot of work to do and whether you like it or not, this noise always ends up bothering you more than you would like.

On 17-A you were head of the police region of the Ebro Lands. Do you remember that day?

— We will remember it for the rest of our lives. We had the famous explosion at the house in Alcanar and I remember it especially because it is not very normal for those of us in charge of the region to go to the scene of the events, but from the first moment that explosion had different characteristics from the rest. As it evolved, it was hard to think about at first, but the possibility was on the table that we were facing an explosion that had nothing to do with gas or the production of narcotic substances.

Do you miss knowing everything about the role of the imam of Ripoll and the connections with the CNI?

— We open an investigation based on objective evidence and deliver the conclusions to the National Court. Those of us who are police officers would like to know everything that has happened but it is complicated: not only technical issues are mixed, but also political, media issues... so I limit myself to the investigation carried out by the Mossos and the evidence they put on top of the court table.

So, are you calm?

— I am satisfied with the investigation we did, yes.

The reaction to those attacks and the prudent behavior of the Mossos on 1-O consolidated the figure of Major Trapero. Has he been politically purged?

— No, I don't understand it that way in any way. I have been in the Mossos d'Esquadra corps for 27 years, I have experienced the change of several commands and there has never been any talk of a purge or anything similar. Changes in our organization fall within normality.

Trapero had shielded, according to some, and isolated, according to others, the Mossos from political action. Will you be more politically permeable?

— I will be politically neutral. All the Mossos move in the most absolute and radical political neutrality because if not, we would be doing the organization and society a disservice. I think we have to differentiate between public security policies and what politics is misunderstood, what we could say partisanship.

Major Trapero is now in the Plaza España police station with clearly less responsibility. Have you intervened in the decision of the current professional position of the older person?

- We have been talking with the Department of the Interior and what we are clear about is that we have to continue taking advantage of the experience and talent of the major, we cannot afford to do without him. The place in the Plaza de España is provisional and we are still talking about what his definitive place within the organization should be, not only in terms of hierarchical structure but also physically. I advance that Major Trapero will surely depend hierarchically on the Ministry of the Interior or the Director General of the Police.

With control functions?

— With command functions over the place where he is assigned and his responsibility.

"I will be politically neutral"

Another of the most delicate decisions has been to relieve Mayor Toni Rodríguez as head of the criminal investigation general police station. Is it because he was considered a Trapero man?

— No. We have a project with strategic lines that we are applying. One is very focused on the internal functioning and has to do with the most collective direction, with teamwork, with the need for the different areas and police stations within the central services to have a much greater coordination; therefore, the replacement of Mayor Rodríguez is conditioned by the will of this new managerial style. And I would even add that I think the replacement has less to do with Rodríguez himself than with the value and technical and leadership capacity of Mayor Ramon Chacon [his replacement].

This unit investigates many cases of corruption. Can the citizens of Catalonia rest assured that corruption and the same cases they had in their hands will continue to be investigated?

- Of course. We must not admit even a millimeter of doubt. We have changed Mayor Rodríguez, who was in charge of the criminal investigation general police station where there are two thousand people working. We have changed a person, not the work team. There is a real will to continue working and persecuting everything that has to do with corruption and that is why our anti-corruption unit will go from the 14 or 15 troops that it now has to 30. Corruption is not only an issue within the political sphere, It affects business, and also the police, the Mossos, the local police, etc.

How is the work protected against the corruption of these Mossos from political interference or any other type?

— There is a way of doing things, an organizational culture, which makes it understood that in certain investigations, due to their sensitivity, there is a higher level of confidentiality and those of us who are in charge of the regions, the divisions, the police stations, We already know that it is not right for us to ask how the investigation is. This has always worked like this. But then, in addition, there are even higher levels of protection. For example, when a court determines that a case is secret from the proceedings and does not want new agents to be assigned or agents to be removed from that investigation, or does not want it to be disclosed. And from here I assure you that the managers and non-managers do not risk our payroll risking putting our noses in certain investigations. But it is that, in addition, now we will internally protocol everything that I am telling you. And if someone crosses any red lines he will have to take responsibility.

This noise can somehow disturb judges and prosecutors, who can refer investigations to other police forces. What would you tell them?

— I have already told you that we will not move an inch, not a millimeter, from what we have done so far. And that if they have any doubts, it is perhaps because they still do not know the new people in charge of the criminal investigation general police station, the criminal investigation division and the anti-corruption unit. Time to time.

You can roll a blunt but you don't know how to get a money order to pay your rent df!

— CHI Fri Jul 02 02:13:26 +0000 2021

What will be the role of commissioner Eduard Sallent, appointed by you?

- We could not do without him because he has a lot of knowledge, he has been head of the body for a year on top of everything, he also knows the organization from the point of view of relations with foreign institutions, not only here in Catalonia but in Madrid. Sallent and Rosa Bosch are in the leadership and are part of the decision core of the senior management of the Mossos d'Esquadra body. I am delighted to be able to work with them.

Will they recover any of the Sallent projects that had been postponed during Trapero's time?

- Why not?

For example?

— Well, projects related to senior management, such as the new structure of the Mossos d'Esquadra body, in which we foresee the creation of areas such as the maritime police division or the famous cyber police station specializing in digital crimes.

One of the most worrying issues is organized crime around marijuana. What is the situation in Catalonia and how is this exponential growth in traffic explained?

— The situation is one of growth. We have gone from seizing 240,000 plants in 2019 and 280,000 in 2020, to 800,000 plants last year. The numbers speak for themselves. We always warned that the problem was not so much the plantations but everything that the installation here of organized groups entailed. We also warn of the links with corruption, because when a drug business is so profitable and so much money is earned, sometimes power structures parallel to the formal ones end up being set up, affecting politicians, businessmen and even policemen.

Are we talking about a mafia that somehow infiltrates these organizations?

— Of course, and this is what has happened in Catalonia. What two or three years ago we said would be the future today is already a present because it is installed here. And with more and more violence.

"When a drug business is so profitable, it fosters mafias that end up affecting politicians, businessmen and even policemen"

And how do you intend to end this situation you describe?

— Our criminal investigation needs to be able to identify these mafias, and work together with the National Police Corps and the Civil Guard; we are talking about the need to speak with Europol, therefore, with the rest of the police in Europe. We also need the involvement of the legislature; surely there has to be a toughening of legislation from the criminal field, this is very clear.

How are relations with the rest of the security forces?

— Relations with the National Police Corps, with the Civil Guard and with local police and urban guards are very good, very good. For a few long months we have put ourselves in the place where we had to be, I think there is a will on the part of everyone to be like that. CITCO, the Intelligence Center against Terrorism and the Crim Organitzat, has been a very useful tool. So that it is understood, the two police forces, the Mossos and the National Police, investigate certain groups and sometimes we end up meeting, and then what CITCO does is make the decision of which of the two follows or if we both follow with a joint team.

What would you like to achieve regarding the relationship with Europol?

— It is clear that a body like ours, which has the will to be the comprehensive police force and to be the police of reference in Catalonia, what it wants is to access Europol in the most direct way possible.

This is far I guess...

—In the last Security Council of Catalonia we have already made some steps forward when it comes to, for example, being able to carry out investigations outside of Catalonia without having to go through the National Police Corps and the Civil Guard, and we have also made some step forward when it comes to connecting directly with certain databases. Well, little by little.

There is another type of crime, sexual crimes, which we have the feeling that they do not stop growing. In addition, with some terrifying examples such as the case of Igualada.

— I will not say anything about the Igualada case because it could affect the investigation we are doing. Globally, in 2021 we have learned of 2,771 sexual abuse or assault in Catalonia, a figure slightly higher than that of 2020 and in line with those of 2019 or 2018. There are still many cases and they are crimes, as happens with other crimes against sexual freedom and also with sexist violence, where the affectation of the victims is very great and also that of their families. For a year and five months, the Mossos have had the central sexual assault unit (UCAS), which helps us to prevent, investigate and instruct certain cases and accompany the victims.

"We have to increase the presence of Mossos on routes from the exit of nightlife venues to public transport"

One of the risks that assault victims face is chemical submission. What do you recommend, for example, to a young teenager when he goes out to party?

— The subject of chemical submission is now coming to the fore a lot and we are working on it. And I already told you that it has a point of difficulty for us, because, of course, there are many questions and there are many situations or descriptions that the victim gives us that are sometimes difficult to verify. We can advise them to be very careful when consuming certain drinks, that if they have any doubts, call 112, that the Mossos will go, and that they can also ask for the support of the private security available at the premises.

Is this collaboration between the Mossos and private security protocolised?

— We are working in Barcelona and in the next few days we want to start closing some specific coordination and collaboration action with private surveillance of entertainment venues, because we want them to be our eyes. We have to work with nightlife to seek the complicity of the people who work in it. We also have to seek to increase the presence of the Mossos, in plainclothes patrols, in certain places and times such as Friday and Saturday nights, especially from the exit of the premises to public transport. And then I also think we have to work hard on information campaigns.